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Post by mycaralwaysbreaks on May 8, 2007 20:29:12 GMT
Soo today it will not run properly again. nothing is fixed and its driving like before bucking like a kangeroo.
Minisport are now coming to pick it up on a traylor to take it back.
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Post by sprocket on May 8, 2007 21:05:32 GMT
The ECU contains a MAP (Manifold Absolute Pressure) sensor which is connected to the manifold, via a fuel trap, at the back near the bulkhead. The problem with this is that fuel still gets to the MAP sensor causing a hydraulic lock resulting in incorrect fueling and ignition. Symptoms of this are violent bucking and backfiring into the inlet manifold. Rover knew about this enough to put out a bulletin on the repair procedure. It simply states to remove the ECU and MAP pipes/ fuel trap, blow through the pipes and fuel trap to clear them out, making sure the elbow ends are not split. Take some cotton wool and screw it up thin enough to be inserted into the MAP connector on the ECU, leave it on a warm radiator over night, then remove the cotton wool and re install into the car.
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Post by sprocket on May 8, 2007 21:21:47 GMT
PROBLEM: ENGINE WILL NOT REV OR RUN - CATALYST FAILURE Engine has a reluctance to rev freely or may not run at all, possibly combined with rattle from catalytic converter.
CAUSE: Catalyst matrix melted resulting in blocked exhaust or detachment of matrix within converter housing. Failure is likely to be due to engine misfire such as described in bulletin No. 0002 (Rotor Arm Problems).
ACTION: Remove catalytic converter and inspect catalyst matrix. If melted the 'Honeycomb' will appear to be blocked. In this event replace converter. Refer to bulletin no. 0002 (Rotor Arm Problem) and carry out action if within suspect range. If not applicable, check HT circuit fully and general engine condition. Rectify as necessary and road test.
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Post by sprocket on May 8, 2007 21:32:52 GMT
PROBLEM: EXHAUST EMISSIONS FAILURE, VARIOUS - due to any of following:-· · High Lambda reading. · · High CO reading at idle / fast idle. · · High HC reading. · · Incorrect idle/fast idle. This bulletin is primarily intended as a diagnostic aid for vehicles which have failed the UK ministry of Transport emissions test, but it may also help diagnose engine running faults. All emission readings provided are the test limits currently agreed for UK vehicles with standard 95 Ron fuel.
CAUSE: Any of the following:-· · Exhaust leak. · · Rich mixture. · · Rich mixture with misfire. · · Weak mixture. · · Oxygen sensor inoperative. · · Catalyst fault. · · Miscellaneous MEMS system faults.
ACTION:
INTRODUCTION; This bulletin should be used with reference to workshop poster D6499TS1, a copy of which is included with this bulletin. A reduced size copy is also included for bulletin record purposes.
Following emissions test failure, the car should be re-checked in accordance with the top row of boxes on the poster and the readings recorded. The boxes include Rovers recommended readings. Having established which readings are outside recommended values, the 'Result' boxes on the lower part of the poster should be applied along with rectification advice suggested later in this bulletin, see 'Result Action' section.
CHECKS AND READINGS EXPLAINED (POSTER); From left to right - upper row 1. Oil temperature is not only a requirement of the UK ministry test but is considered necessary to confirm engine is fully warm and provide accurate engine readings, coolant temperature alone is not sufficient since coolant reaches its correct temperature prematurely. 2. By raising engine speed to fast idle the fuelling changes from open loop to 'closed loop' (catalyst lit). Fast idle speed parameters vary dependent on MEMS tune, i.e. K 1.4 requires a lower parameter to prevent system inadvertently returning to an 'open loop' condition. 3. CO (Carbon Monoxide) at fast idle is only relevant if found to be higher than limits. Lower readings can be ignored. 4. HC (Hydrocarbons) readings are necessary to give indications as to a possible engine malfunction. 5. Lambda is a calculation of the actual fuel ratio divided by a standard air fuel ratio, for example 16.1 (recorded AFR) divided by (14.7 (standard AFR) = 1.09 Lambda. Lambda may be considered as a variation around the ideal mixture value. 6. Re-checking CO (Carbon Monoxide) at idle will provide a reading in an open loop condition, if CO is within limits this confirms catalyst is still efficient in this mode. 7. O2 (Oxygen) reading obtained at idle. Reading provides a measure of oxygen content, relevant for diagnosis of certain conditions. 8. Oxygen sensor voltage swing test to confirm correct oxygen sensor function. Voltage stuck high or low may indicate fuel mixture errors, see 'Poster Results' for further information.
RESULTS ACTION (POSTER)
EXHAUST LEAK: Inspect complete exhaust system, including manifold for leaks. To exaggerate leak, partially block off tail pipe during inspection. Exhaust system joints may require re-sealing even if they appear intact, even minute leaks, i.e. around clamped connection joints will have an adverse affect on emissions reading. Note: If CO reading was high, this may indicate leak is before the oxygen sensor, i.e. exhaust manifold joint.
RICH MIXTURE Possible causes: · · pressure high (manifold pressure). · · Valve timing incorrect. · · Injectors over-fuelling. · · High fuel pressure - kinked return pipe. Run TestBook 'Healthcheck' to test complete MEMS system, view results and correct any failures.
RICH MIXTURE WITH MISFIRE Possible causes: · · Valves burnt. · · Valves bent or seating badly (see Note:). Check with KV tester or oscilloscope to diagnose HT related causes. If no HT faults are found, check cylinder compression or carry out cylinder leakage test. Rectify electrical or mechanical cause as necessary. Note: Condition may be due to valve sticking, refer to appropriate Technical Bulletins for advice. 'K' Series - Bulletin 0001, (engine section) or 'T' Series -Bulletin 0015 (engine section).
WEAK MIXTURE Possible causes: · · Fuel pressure too low (e.g. Blocked fuel filter) · · Blocked fuel injector. Run TestBook 'Healthcheck' to test complete MEMS system, view results and correct any failures.
OXYGEN SENSOR INOPERATIVE Oxygen sensor testing; The oxygen sensor operation can be tested via TestBook. If unavailable, use Tool 18G1639. Either can be used to view an actual voltage swing to confirm correct oxygen sensor function. Note: An added advantage with TestBook is the ability to view other related information, on the same screen, i.e., engine speed, throttle angle, MAP reading, stepper steps, ignition advance, coolant temp, inlet air temp, battery volts, ignition switch and injector dead time.
Oxygen Sensor Check - TestBook: From the welcome screen , select - 'Diagnostic System'. When requested select appropriate MEMS system. Proceed as instructed until menu screen appears, select - 'Sub System Tests'. From this screen select - 'Display Outputs'. From this screen select - 'General'. Select OxySense Volts and Feedback % (see illustration 2). OxySense Volts - See 'Test Results' later in this bulletin for acceptable readings. Feedback - Display of feedback fuelling correction. This is shown as a percentage of the mapped (open loop) value. Percentage is continuously updated by the MEMS ECM whenever the conditions for closed loop fuelling are present. High values of feedback (e.g. above 100%) indicate that feed back is attempting to compensate for fuelling being too lean. Lean values (e.g. below 100%) indicate fuelling being too rich. Note: Misfire condition will be shown as high values as feedback will be fooled into compensating for a system running too lean. Oxygen Sensor Check - Tool 18G1639 (alternative method) A voltmeter may be connected between the sensor and engine harness connection. A tee-in tool is available for this purpose, part number:-18G 1639 (for square type engine harness connections) Procedure: Ensure engine is at correct running temperature. Switch off engine and connect 'T' lead 18G 1639 between oxygen sensor and engine harness. Connect 'T' lead voltmeter connections, yellow to voltmeter negative and green to voltmeter positive.
Oxygen Sensor Check - Method (for both TestBook and Tee-in tool use): Increase engine speed to 3000 r.p.m for approximately 30 seconds then allow to idle, this is necessary to ensure oxygen sensor is at operating temperature. If voltage swings regularly between below 0.4 and above 0.6 volts, sensor is operating correctly. If reading is stuck high or low (see associated readings detailed on poster) this will indicate sensor is not working.
Oxygen Sensor voltage stuck high or low: If engine has been idling or running at low rpm for long periods prior to test, sensor may have become sooted, road test with engine speed held high in an attempt to clean sensor without removal. If above fails to resolve condition, remove sensor and view tip, if still sooted, carefully clean and refit to vehicle for re-test. If sensor voltage refuses to swing and remains high, fault may be rich mixture. Check fuel return lines for kinks or restrictions or carry out fuel pressure check. If fuel system faults are eliminated and sensor refuses to swing correctly, replace sensor.
Oxygen sensor testing - General; If the system is working properly, the meter reading will switch regularly between below 0.4v and above 0.6v. The actual meter readings are not too important, the fact that it oscillates between low and high values is enough to prove the system is working and hence, that fuelling is unlikely to be the cause of any running problems. If during the test, readings did not oscillate but remained high, the mixture is over rich. Check for kinks or restrictions in the fuel return line or use TestBook to diagnose the fuel system. A constantly low reading could be due to one of two things, either the fuelling is too weak, or the oxygen sensor is not working. With the engine running, clamp the fuel return line for a maximum of 10 seconds, this will create an over rich mixture which in turn should prompt a high voltage reading (above 0.6v) from the oxygen sensor. If this is the case then check for a blocked fuel filter, kinked fuel feed line or any other possible causes. Note: Fuel hoses must be clamped for a short periods with approved Girling brake hose clamp No. 64947017.
CATALYST FAULT It is unlikely that the catalyst has failed unless it has been subjected to an unchecked misfire condition or incorrect fuel use. Since a new catalyst is a very expensive component it should only be replaced as a last resort. A catalyst which has completely failed will on removal from the vehicle either deposit loose matrix particles and when shaken be heard to rattle in casing or if viewed through open end show that matrix is blocked or melted. MISCELLANEOUS RESULTS Run TestBook 'Healthcheck' to test complete MEMS system, view results and correct any failures. Healthcheck can be accessed via the following route: From the welcome screen , select - 'Diagnostic System'. When requested select appropriate MEMS system. Proceed as instructed until menu screen appears, select - 'Healthcheck'.
CONCLUSION
Applying poster: · · Identify emission irregularities by comparing actual readings with those from poster. · · Compare result combinations with those from poster for likely cause. Recommended diagnostic tools: · · Use TestBook (display outputs) or Tool 18G1639 for checking voltage swings. · · Use TestBook (Healthcheck) for general MEMS check. · · Use oscilloscope to diagnose HT faults. · · Use compression tester or leakage tester for checking engine condition.
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Post by sprocket on May 8, 2007 21:37:37 GMT
PROBLEM:
POOR IDLE FOLLOWING ENGINE/MEMS REPAIR - ECU ADAPTION Following certain Engine/Engine Management related repairs, customer may complain of poor engine idle quality, either too high, too low, idles erratically or has a tendency to stall. Such repair types are as follows:-Engine replacement. · · Cylinder head/valve decoke i.e. to correct valve sticking. · · Fuel pressure related repairs. · · Oxygen sensor replacement. · · Injector replacement. If vehicle is returned to customer in the condition described it may then be rejected as unacceptable, this may then result in an ECM replacement in an attempt to provide an immediate solution. Investigation of ECM's replaced under warranty show no real fault exists other than map settings away from standard.
CAUSE: When any MEMS vehicle develops certain engine component faults which affect tune condition, the ECM will try to 'adapt' in an attempt to correct the tune irregularity. If the source of the problem is subsequently corrected, the ECM may not immediately re-set back to standard but take several miles and a variety of driving conditions to re-adapt. All MEMS vehicles have the ability to adapt and will eventually re-adapt on their own following a repair, however 1.6 MEMS and 1.9 MEMS vehicles only can be corrected instantly by using TestBook, see procedure below.
ACTION: The ECM may be returned to its original default condition by using the 'Re-Set Adaptions' facility introduced with the latest TestBook CD release - 'DRC0003', although this CD is primarily for New 200 & New 400 it may be used for MEMS 'Re-Set Adaption' on any MEMS 1.6/1.9 vehicle by using 'Expert Toolbox'. Procedure: Response & Action 1. Select 'Expert Toolbox'. 2. Select New Rover 400, New 200 or other, - Press 'Continue'. 3. Enter Vin if New 400 or New 200, press continue, skip by pressing 'Continue' if other models. Note: If no Vin can be entered a Warning message appears, - press 'Ignore'. 4. If New 400 or New 200, confirm Vin and press 'Continue', skip by pressing 'Continue' if other models. 5. 'EXPERT TOOLBOX AUTHORISATION' screen appears, press 'Continue'. 6. 'SYSTEM SELECTION' screen appears - select either engine size 1.4/1.6 or 2.0 for New 400 or 1.4/1.6 for New 200, if other vehicles select engine size as appropriate. 7. 'MEMS ECM COMMUNICATION' screen appears, prepare vehicle as per screen instructions, then press 'Continue'. 8. 'INITIALISATION' screen appears with information. 9. 'Select Required Option' screen appears - select 'ECM Options'. 10. Option screen appears, select 'Reset Adaptions'. 11. 'RESET ADAPTIVE VALUES' screen appears, press 'Continue' and proceed as instructed.
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Post by sprocket on May 8, 2007 21:42:34 GMT
PROBLEM:
FLAT SPOT - FUEL IN VAC PIPE Flat spot, poor performance or stalling.
CAUSE: Fuel contamination of manifold to E.C.U. vacuum pipe.
ACTION:
THIS TECHNICAL BULLETIN REPLACES BULLETIN ROVER 200/400 NO 33 -ITEM 56
Fit a fuel trap in the system using the following procedure: 1. Remove vacuum pipe from manifold and E.C.U, note which end was fitted to E.C.U. 2. Check for evidence of fuel contamination at that end. 3. Blow out any fuel from vacuum pipe. If fuel was found at the E.C.U. end of vacuum pipe, remove E.C.U. and drain off any fuel that may have entered. A suggested method of clearing E.C.U. is to insert a piece of fine synthetic thread at least 8 cm long into stub pipe and invert E.C.U. on a hot surface, such as a radiator (The thread will act as a wick to drain the fuel). If no fuel was evident at E.C.U. end of vacuum pipe it is not necessary to remove the E.C.U. 4. Obtain new hose part number MLH10006 and shorten to 220 mm. 5. Modify the original vacuum pipe by removing the rubber hose from the hard plastic pipe (E.C.U. end) and shorten plastic pipe by 110 mm. 6. Refit rubber hose. 7. Connect new shortened hose MLH10006 between inlet manifold and fuel trap NPC10001 long stub pipe (black). 8. Fit the original vacuum pipe in a reversed orientation between the E.C.U. and the fuel trap short stub pipe (green). 9. Secure fuel trap in an UPRIGHT position (stub pipes to bottom) to the fuel filter bracket with cable strap GHF1267, a redundant square hole can be found in the bracket for this purpose. 10. Position strap vertically between stub pipes and secure strap so that base of fuel trap locates on to top of bracket. 11. Ensure an uphill run exists between inlet manifold and fuel trap, also that fuel trap is positioned vertically.
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Post by JT on May 9, 2007 23:42:38 GMT
great what do you want? a badge??
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Post by dev on May 10, 2007 7:53:47 GMT
No Sprocket already has a gold blue peter badge.
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Post by sprocket on May 10, 2007 14:36:31 GMT
great what do you want? a badge?? Do you have a problem?!
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Post by crazypaul on May 10, 2007 16:26:21 GMT
well, the cars back at mini sport and im awaiting to hear from them, you dont even want to no the trouble i had to get them to except and take the car, well have to see, and thanks for the advice.......... intresting reading mate
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Post by greasemonkey1 on May 10, 2007 17:59:02 GMT
great what do you want? a badge?? Do you have a problem?! Yep, He's a wa££er who thinks he knows it all!
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Post by The Roadie on May 10, 2007 20:13:28 GMT
Greasemonkey - either be nice or f**k off. Who are you anyway? Can you not post who you really are?
Sound (if longwinded) advice from Sprocket now get off his case.
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Post by MR KNOW IT ALL on May 10, 2007 20:13:40 GMT
At least he provided useful info and not bs which is more than can be said for some.
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Post by sprocket on May 10, 2007 21:32:51 GMT
Greasemonkey - either be nice or f**k off. Who are you anyway? Can you not post who you really are? Sound (if longwinded) advice from Sprocket now get off his case. Mearly a cut and paste from a rover workshop manual buddy. And yes it wasnt untill i read it back it apeared long winded. However, i felt you should at least know what Rover have to say about it so you have a head start on detecting the bullnuts that MiniSport may or may not feed you.
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Post by The Roadie on May 11, 2007 13:21:13 GMT
Yeah you did the right thing mate, very useful stuff.
Just annoys me when someone being a bit small minded attacks you for giving out relevant advice.
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